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Posted 9/8/2016 22:53 (#5518302)
Subject: Fence/wire question

SE ND

I am looking at cross fencing a pasture with 3 strand barb wire under contract with NRCS. Anything special to watch out for?

Wire options are 12.5 GA standard barb wire (which I use now). Or 14 or 15.5 GA high tensile barb wire. Lookin for cost, installation ease and longevity? Never done high tensile before,so looking for honest opinion on what the actual difference is. ntexcotton

Posted 9/8/2016 23:11 (#5518356 - in reply to #5518302)
Subject: RE: Fence/wire question

North Central Texas

Nrcs will be specific and sometimes by county on the brand of wire used. No light wire is allowed like gaucho. No utility/commercial wire either. Most require the astm label with the heavy galvanized coating. Corners/braces are specific also.

T posts have to be 1.33 and must now be 18" deep.

Edited by ntexcotton 9/8/2016 23:15

carlsoncl

Posted 9/8/2016 23:27 (#5518392 - in reply to #5518302)
Subject: RE: Fence/wire question

Beresford, SD

I'm sorry, tell NRCS to fly a kite. If it makes sence do it with a single hot wire........not a fan of hand outs. What they advise normally makes sence, but we can do it for pennies on our own compared to their rules and regs. My two cents. cornlover

Posted 9/8/2016 23:31 (#5518401 - in reply to #5518302)
Subject: RE: Fence/wire question

Just make sure you can space wires where you want them. They like to make them "billy goat friendly" Also make sure they don't require you to put bird reflectors on top wire for grouse. You dealing with the devil, make sure all this stuff is talked about BEFORE signing with them. Jim

Posted 9/8/2016 23:33 (#5518405 - in reply to #5518302)
Subject: RE: Fence/wire question

Driftless SW Wisconsin

In barb wire the 12.5 Red Brand barb is much easier to use than the high tensile/thinner gage barb wires which keep trying to spring back into a coil.

Helland

Posted 9/8/2016 23:57 (#5518430 - in reply to #5518392)
Subject: RE: Fence/wire question

SE ND

What kind of hot fence? Never done much with hot fence. Don't want something that has to be redone in few years or takes maintenance. Helland

Posted 9/9/2016 00:00 (#5518433 - in reply to #5518356)
Subject: RE: Fence/wire question

SE ND

Don't see anything about brand. Do see 18 inches deep, can be 1.25 pound posts. Helland

Posted 9/9/2016 00:02 (#5518434 - in reply to #5518401)
Subject: RE: Fence/wire question

SE ND

Top wire 42 inches, other 2 spaced at even spacing. Didn't see anything about animals to consider. Helland

Posted 9/9/2016 00:03 (#5518436 - in reply to #5518405)
Subject: RE: Fence/wire question

SE ND

That's what dad switched to using before he passed away so that's what I have been using on my fence replacements. mohoff

Posted 9/9/2016 05:05 (#5518501 - in reply to #5518302)
Subject: RE: Fence/wire question

SC,Missouri

I wouldn't mess with putting up a 3 strand that fence won't last no time and cattle be through it all the time. I wouldn't do it unless it's 5 strand or hotwire like Carlson said. O.u.and.direct

Posted 9/9/2016 05:15 (#5518507 - in reply to #5518501)
Subject: RE: Fence/wire question

Southwest Missouri

mohoff - 9/9/2016 05:05

I wouldn't mess with putting up a 3 strand that fence won't last no time and cattle be through it all the time. I wouldn't do it unless it's 5 strand or hotwire like Carlson said.

+ 1,5 and 6 strand fences here at the end of the day what the heck is an extra roll or two of wire on a 1/4 mile fence. farmer82

Posted 9/9/2016 05:17 (#5518508 - in reply to #5518501)
Subject: RE: Fence/wire question

S.E. Iowa

My son was all excited about getting equip. It got so bad that he got his banker to write a hardship letter to get him out of it. Run and do it yourself. Then there was the grazing expert. kentuckyfarmer

Posted 9/9/2016 06:36 (#5518586 - in reply to #5518302)
Subject: RE: Fence/wire question

North Central Kentucky

I guess I am in the minority, but I really like working with NRCS. Maybe it can be as good or bad as the folks at a particular office? I got NRCS to help with the farm I bought a few years ago. I have everything cross fenced with fence line waterers. I am very pleased with how it turned out. It was also nice to have their advice. They were very flexible with me and tried to make sure I could do what worked for me within their rules.

As far as your question, my cross fence is 5 strand (they paid for 4). I got an 11x16 paper from them with diagrams of how to build and a sheet attached with approved materials. The same for the waterers. No wildlife considerations. cornlover

Posted 9/9/2016 06:56 (#5518621 - in reply to #5518501)
Subject: RE: Fence/wire question

I use three wire barb in big country. Use them as drift fences on section lines in big pastures. Keep them tight, work fine. Nemo rancher

Posted 9/9/2016 06:56 (#5518622 - in reply to #5518302)
Subject: If you use barb,

go with 14 gauge hi-tensile. Stouter than 12.5 barb and MUCH greater galvanization. Direct Injected

Posted 9/9/2016 07:00 (#5518634 - in reply to #5518507)
Subject: RE: Fence/wire question

SW, Missouri

mohoff - 9/9/2016 05:05

I wouldn't mess with putting up a 3 strand that fence won't last no time and cattle be through it all the time. I wouldn't do it unless it's 5 strand or hotwire like Carlson said.

+ 1,5 and 6 strand fences here at the end of the day what the heck is an extra roll or two of wire on a 1/4 mile fence.

O.u.and.direct - 9/9/2016 05:15+ 1,5 and 6 strand fences here at the end of the day what the heck is an extra roll or two of wire on a 1/4 mile fence.

Direct Injected

Posted 9/9/2016 07:01 (#5518636 - in reply to #5518622)
Subject: RE: If you use barb,

SW, Missouri

What brand do you like? I've considered using some, last couple times I put up red brand it was junk IMO. Texas Papaw

Posted 9/9/2016 07:40 (#5518730 - in reply to #5518302)
Subject: RE: Fence/wire question

Central Texas

Was at field day several years ago at a place that was formerly cropland and used NRCS program to fence and water it. It was crossfenced with either 2 or 3 wire electric with steel H braces and steel gates. Think NRCS paid 75% and owner 25%. Was talking to NRCS man on site and asked him if owner couldn't build single wire electric out of his pocket for less than his share of the NRCS fence. Sheepishly he replied Yes.

My 2 cents worth is build a one wire hi-tensile electric using 1" fiberglass end/corner posts and 3/8 fg line post. If properly constructed with no metal posts, will be as maintenance free as any fence. By avoiding metal posts this will greatly minimize the chances of fence getting shorted out. FG posts will flex when hit by deer, etc. Also this will allow you to further cross fence with polywire any time you wish. This will give you a lot of flexibility. FWIW, electric cross fence is all I install. Is also easy to remove from lease pastures when lease ends. Go to Kencove.com. They have the supplies you will need and good fencing tips also. Suggest calling them as their sales people are very knowledgeable and helpful.

Bet you can self pay for a good e-fence a lot cheaper than your share of the NRCS version. Nemo rancher

Posted 9/9/2016 08:25 (#5518834 - in reply to #5518636)
Subject: RE: If you use barb,

I use OK or Herdsman. Tried to get the green from Baekert one time but couldn't get any dealer to sell it to me..

The class III galvanization makes all the difference, I think. Don't use Gaucho anymore, but have some 30 yr. or so old still silver. Regular barb seems to rust in no time. ntexcotton

Posted 9/9/2016 08:30 (#5518849 - in reply to #5518730)
Subject: RE: Fence/wire question

North Central Texas

Few years ago they paid 1.65 for 5 wire and 1.10 for electric. Those numbers are half today. 5 wire material is .65 and I can build the permanent electric 3 wire for around .30 or less depending on corner requirements. Turn in the bill with your labor on it and they pay materials plus some more. sdnotill1983

Posted 9/9/2016 09:23 (#5518976 - in reply to #5518849)
Subject: RE: Fence/wire question

SE SD

You could ask for a modification of your contract and switch to electric cross fence. Here it is the same rate if you put in 1 hot wire cross fence or 5 wires.

SD EQIP pays .93/ft for multi strand barbed wire and .61/ft for electric, and woven wire 1.28/ft

Edited by sdnotill1983 9/9/2016 09:27

KDK Herefords

Posted 9/9/2016 15:17 (#5519597 - in reply to #5518392)
Subject: RE: Fence/wire question

East Central, IA

+1 tjdub

Posted 9/9/2016 19:41 (#5519980 - in reply to #5518430)
Subject: RE: Fence/wire question

This kind of fence costs in the neighborhood of 5 cents per ft and you can put up or take down 1/4 mile length in about half an hour.



This is just 3/8" fiberglass posts spaced at 32ft with stainless steel clips and 14 guage wire with a single t-post as a corner.

Will the cows rotate themselves when the creek gets too high or a tree falls and shorts out the wire, you bet they will. But if it's just a cross fence, do you care? Just my 2 cents.

Edited by tjdub 9/9/2016 19:45

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03-19-2013, 03:18 PM mainelander  

742 posts, read 1,228,953 times

Reputation: 345

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I am interested in having an electric fence to keep some critters in and i went to tractor supply and the energizers they offer only seem to have one in and one out, so how does on do multiple wires?

Much appreciated!

 

03-19-2013, 06:45 PM Red Wolf  

797 posts, read 1,344,622 times

Reputation: 992

splice your electric fence wire to the wire leading out of the fencer.

I have used electric fencing since the early 70's and have done dairy rotational grazing with electric fences dividing paddocks since 1993.

My son in on the dairy farm now and is continuing the roatational grazing.

I will be glad to answer any questions you may have.

 

03-20-2013, 05:47 AM mainelander  

742 posts, read 1,228,953 times

Reputation: 345

Well thank you for answering! Are you saying I do something like this attached pic?

Attached Thumbnails  

 

03-20-2013, 06:58 AM Red Wolf  

797 posts, read 1,344,622 times

Reputation: 992

On an electric fencer, there will be 2 wires attatched.

One is plainly marked...ground
( the wire from there goes to a ground rod)

The other will be for the " hot " wire leading to your fence.
That wire gets attatched to your electric fence and any wires attatched to that will be hot also.

You do not need to " loop" your pasture fence and return back to the charger.
You may run your fence for 15 miles all in one direction or make a square, rectangle, triangle, or oblong pasture.

Everything gets "hot" by being attatched to the one,hot,wire leading out of your fencer.

 

03-20-2013, 07:13 AM mainelander  

742 posts, read 1,228,953 times

Reputation: 345

Thank you, I havent bought it yet, so i am only nominally familiar with the actual charger. SO does the ground get run along parallel to the hot?

 

03-20-2013, 07:32 AM Red Wolf  

797 posts, read 1,344,622 times

Reputation: 992

The ground only goes a foot or two and then is attatched to a grounding rod driven into the ground.

 

03-20-2013, 09:25 PM foxywench  

Location: North Western NJ

6,591 posts, read 24,862,283 times

Reputation: 9683

DONT OVER THINK IT.
it realy is very simple.

1: get a charger BIGGER than you think youll need..

and remember each line adds to the chargers load, so say your running a 1 mile fence...BUT your running 4 live strands thats a total of 4 miles of electric fence...
now add in how many times you might want to cross fence, modify possibly add a line.
also remember that you must take into account the distance form where your charger will be to where you wantyour fence...if youve got a mile between the charger and the electric fence itself add that into the equation becaue despite the lead out line being insulated its still powering that lenght of line.

I knew i neeed a 1 mile perimeter fence, i knew running goats id need 4 lines...so thats 4 miles total...but then i thought well what if i want to add electric to the outside of a chicken coop, or need to build a seperate buck pen, or want to rotationally graze ect...so i bought the 10 mile charger cause thats as large as i could affor at the time...

2: be sure to go low impedance, itll help if you take a couple days too long to weed wack and getthe occasionalblade of grass, or if your going through a wooded area and might get the occasional branch ect...
it takes quite alot to effect the volatage on my fence.

3: did i mention dont over think it?!

when i started looking i looked too much and just confused myself...
in reality this is a very simple system....you do NOT have to bring your fence back to the box or to itself...so you can do 1 long line, or you can do a circle or you can do a square of a zig zag your only limit is your own imagination and the number of posts/insulators you have lol.

baic basic set up.
green terminal is ground. form this terminal you take 1 lenght of INSULATED wire and attatch it to your ground rod. your ground rod should be no more than 20ft form your charger...
if your in an area of poor grounding or going to be running alot of fenceline...MORE GROUND RODS...i live heavy clay and whent with 3 6ft grounding rods the better your grounding the better the system works!
if running multiple grounding rods...you attatch grounding rod 1 to the green on your charger, then attach insulated wire to the grounding rod and run to the next grounding rod (about 10ft away) repeat as nessicary, all grounding rods shoudl be attatched to eachother, with the one closest to the box attatched to the box's ground terminal...thats IT for grounding...your done with that terminal.

now for your live wire.
step 1: run your electirc fence line...DONT SKIMP, go with the larger guage for best results
i whent with 14g, 12 is even better. a frined has 17g electrc fence and mine gets a much cleaner zap to it...shes now upgradingin her fence to 14g and has noticed a difference in her goats behaviour...

run your lines, use good insulators dont put your posts too close together (you want some "elasticity" to it, dont want ti to sap and pull inulators off everytime something catches the fence.)
should be tight enough to ot sag but unless your doing high tensile fencing, shouldstill have some "spring" to it.

once your fence is run you take a peice of INSULATED wire (itll be 12g usually) same type you just ran to the gorunding rods....attatch it to the red/live terminal and run it to your fence...if running it over a distance i suggest using some pvc pipe/conduit to protect it from trips, lawnmowers ect) youll simply hook the exposed metal insie the insulated wire to the fence...tada whichever line its hooked to is now your live wire...

but you want to make 2 lines hot...or 3...or 4.....EASY. take a little peice of that insulated wire and make a bridge, attach a bit of metal in the insulated wire to the live line and then to the line you want to add and make hot...and tada, a 2 line ence...
want 3, take another peice ofinuslated and hook it form line 2 to line 3, contiue untill you have all the lines you want hooked up.
(they do acutallymake little kits that you can use to do this without hacking up insulated wire but im poor so i used what i had on hand lol

4: INVEST in a good voltage reader.
theres "fence testers" out there for 3.99 thats jut a little light that blinks if your ence is "live" well thats great but itll blink if theres even a few volts making it to the fence...you want to know just how much power your fence is getting...and a single blinking lights not going to tell you that, a good voltmeter however will

plug in fence charger, your box should make a quiet but audible Click sound and most have alittle orange blinking "fence ok" light, then take your voltmeter to your fence, stick the rod in the ground and touch it to any of your "hot" lines and you should see quite a good deal of voltage PULSING...itll be up and gone and up and gone and up and gone...thats normal.
assuming your getting a good reading your good to go...
if not it means your probably grounding out somewhere so check your fenceline for sticks, anywheewhere the line is touchign a metal post or chainlink type fencing, wet vegitation in high volumes ect...carefully clear and re check.

check your fence regularly for grass grwing, fallen branches ect...

If I can do it...anyone can lol
just be sure to unplug it before doing any groud maintennce, it gives you quite a little chock if you hit it with any of the metal parts of a weed wacker...lol

i was in the same boat, never worked with an electric fence, NOT technically minded. and heres what i learnt.DONT OVER THINK IT.it realy is very simple.1: get a charger BIGGER than you think youll need..and remember each line adds to the chargers load, so say your running a 1 mile fence...BUT your running 4 live strands thats a total of 4 miles of electric fence...now add in how many times you might want to cross fence, modify possibly add a line.also remember that you must take into account the distance form where your charger will be to where you wantyour fence...if youve got a mile between the charger and the electric fence itself add that into the equation becaue despite the lead out line being insulated its still powering that lenght of line.I knew i neeed a 1 mile perimeter fence, i knew running goats id need 4 lines...so thats 4 miles total...but then i thought well what if i want to add electric to the outside of a chicken coop, or need to build a seperate buck pen, or want to rotationally graze ect...so i bought the 10 mile charger cause thats as large as i could affor at the time...2: be sure to go low impedance, itll help if you take a couple days too long to weed wack and getthe occasionalblade of grass, or if your going through a wooded area and might get the occasional branch ect...it takes quite alot to effect the volatage on my fence.3: did i mention dont over think it?!when i started looking i looked too much and just confused myself...in reality this is a very simple system....you do NOT have to bring your fence back to the box or to itself...so you can do 1 long line, or you can do a circle or you can do a square of a zig zag your only limit is your own imagination and the number of posts/insulators you have lol.baic basic set up.green terminal is ground. form this terminal you take 1 lenght of INSULATED wire and attatch it to your ground rod. your ground rod should be no more than 20ft form your charger...if your in an area of poor grounding or going to be running alot of fenceline...MORE GROUND RODS...i live heavy clay and whent with 3 6ft grounding rods the better your grounding the better the system works!if running multiple grounding rods...you attatch grounding rod 1 to the green on your charger, then attach insulated wire to the grounding rod and run to the next grounding rod (about 10ft away) repeat as nessicary, all grounding rods shoudl be attatched to eachother, with the one closest to the box attatched to the box's ground terminal...thats IT for grounding...your done with that terminal.now for your live wire.step 1: run your electirc fence line...DONT SKIMP, go with the larger guage for best resultsi whent with 14g, 12 is even better. a frined has 17g electrc fence and mine gets a much cleaner zap to it...shes now upgradingin her fence to 14g and has noticed a difference in her goats behaviour...run your lines, use good insulators dont put your posts too close together (you want some "elasticity" to it, dont want ti to sap and pull inulators off everytime something catches the fence.)should be tight enough to ot sag but unless your doing high tensile fencing, shouldstill have some "spring" to it.once your fence is run you take a peice of INSULATED wire (itll be 12g usually) same type you just ran to the gorunding rods....attatch it to the red/live terminal and run it to your fence...if running it over a distance i suggest using some pvc pipe/conduit to protect it from trips, lawnmowers ect) youll simply hook the exposed metal insie the insulated wire to the fence...tada whichever line its hooked to is now your live wire...but you want to make 2 lines hot...or 3...or 4.....EASY. take a little peice of that insulated wire and make a bridge, attach a bit of metal in the insulated wire to the live line and then to the line you want to add and make hot...and tada, a 2 line ence...want 3, take another peice ofinuslated and hook it form line 2 to line 3, contiue untill you have all the lines you want hooked up.(they do acutallymake little kits that you can use to do this without hacking up insulated wire but im poor so i used what i had on hand lol4: INVEST in a good voltage reader.theres "fence testers" out there for 3.99 thats jut a little light that blinks if your ence is "live" well thats great but itll blink if theres even a few volts making it to the fence...you want to know just how much power your fence is getting...and a single blinking lights not going to tell you that, a good voltmeter however willplug in fence charger, your box should make a quiet but audible Click sound and most have alittle orange blinking "fence ok" light, then take your voltmeter to your fence, stick the rod in the ground and touch it to any of your "hot" lines and you should see quite a good deal of voltage PULSING...itll be up and gone and up and gone and up and gone...thats normal.assuming your getting a good reading your good to go...if not it means your probably grounding out somewhere so check your fenceline for sticks, anywheewhere the line is touchign a metal post or chainlink type fencing, wet vegitation in high volumes ect...carefully clear and re check.check your fence regularly for grass grwing, fallen branches ect...If I can do it...anyone can loljust be sure to unplug it before doing any groud maintennce, it gives you quite a little chock if you hit it with any of the metal parts of a weed wacker...lol

 

03-20-2013, 09:33 PM foxywench  

Location: North Western NJ

6,591 posts, read 24,862,283 times

Reputation: 9683

green is ground, grey posts in the ground on the left as your looking are your ground rods.
red is Live, brown posts fence posts, grey horizontals your electric fence wire.

thick black line is your INSULATED wire.

heres a VERY simplified imagegreen is ground, grey posts in the ground on the left as your looking are your ground rods.red is Live, brown posts fence posts, grey horizontals your electric fence wire.thick black line is your INSULATED wire.

 

03-21-2013, 05:35 AM ognend  

2,878 posts, read 4,632,784 times

Reputation: 3113

Google bi-polar horse fencing - it is so simple and multitudes times better - the "wires" are actually wide tapes, very easy to install.
OD

 

03-21-2013, 07:30 AM Red Wolf  

797 posts, read 1,344,622 times

Reputation: 992

I really like electric fences and used primarily the step-in fiberglas posts for interior fencing on rotational grazing.

On interior fencing, I use lightweight aluminum electric fence wire because I then can put my fiberglas posts 45 ft apart ( 15 paces ) and it hold the wire tight.

I am not a big fan of heavy electric wire unless it is for the perimeter fence.

(too hard to work with requiring too many electric posts to hold it up )

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